Yes, I am late to the Joss party

[justalurkr]

I'd been seeing references to Joss Whedon and misogyny and going "eh?" for some time now. amireal and Google got me caught up:

A Rapist's View of the World: Joss Whedon and Firefly

The "radfem" LJ post that seems to have started it all, and an excellent illustration of why I am a closet feminist, and a cane-whacking geezer closet feminist, at that. You little girls have no idea what it's like to have a man promoted over you and have it be legal for the promoter to say "well, he's got a family to support" and have no legal recourse. (Okay, neither do I, but I heard about it from my mom.)

I hope I'm being punked (Ace of Spades)


A blogger's reaction to _allecto_'s piece, the link to which I found from:

Joss Whedon Misogynist? (Dr. Melissa Clouthier)

This person with whom I totally agree when she asks "Were you watching the same show I was watching?"

I've always viewed the disasters that occur to women (interpreted in the first essay as Joss taking "glee" in their plight) as Joss saying "See? This is what the world dishes out to women" rather than "w00t! This what I'd like to do to women!" It does make me wonder if _allecto_'s essay would even be possible if Joss weren't a white male.

Oh, wait. I'm a veteran of enough "omg SLASH IS MISOGYNIST!" flamewars to know the answer to that. If a woman raked in the dough producing a show about ass-kicking vampire- or Reaver-slayers, she'd be a pawn of patriarchy.

My brand of feminism?
Whatever goes on between or among consenting adults is their business.

Equal pay for equal work should never have been a topic of debate.

If giving birth is going to end your life as you know it, crossing your legs and keeping them crossed is a really good idea, but I'll drive you to the clinic if it comes down to that and I can't talk you out of giving the kid the same chance you had.

Love and money have nothing to do with each other: if you've got a nickel to your name, get the pre-nup, and don't get all flouncy if your spouse-to-be plonks one in front of you. Also, have an attorney look at it.

If you've got more kids than money for college tuition, who's oldest or who's the most [insert gender here] or even who's the smartest doesn't enter into it: educate the one(s) who will take it the most seriously and go the farthest. (I say this as an unusually intelligent only child upon whom college tuition was most likely wasted, thanks to a deficit of self-discipline and ambition.)

Comments

[ducks-in-a-row.livejournal.com]

I caught wind of this last week and was literally too mindboggled to even think about it. There's no doubt this person did not watch the same show I did, and furthermore I don't think it's possible for her to watch *any* show and see the same thing I do. If you go in with the viewpoint that 1) all men are rapists, 2) all het relationships are EVIL, and 3) there should be no racial mixing in any sense--you're going to have a hard time finding anything pleasant to watch/read.

If I cared about labeling myself, I would still consider myself a feminist because I believe that no one should degraded because of *what* they are (female/black/gay/etc). For *my* money, this person is not a feminist in any sense of the word. Rabid hatred of 90% of the human race =/= feminism. It just equals hate.

[justalurkr.livejournal.com]

Well, I had my first issue with the lesbian-feminist-sisters thing. The more modifiers hung on a noun meant to be inclusive, the less I am inclined to view the speaker as such, especially in the context of a feminist summit.

People who are not gay or female actually do have a place at my roundtable discussion of feminism.

[ducks-in-a-row.livejournal.com]

People who are not gay or female actually do have a place at my roundtable discussion of feminism.

Makes perfect sense to me. Talking only to people who already share your viewpoint doesn't really accomplish much. Inviting other viewpoints...well, at the very least it makes it interesting :-)

[nialla]

You little girls have no idea what it's like to have a man promoted over you and have it be legal for the promoter to say "well, he's got a family to support" and have no legal recourse. (Okay, neither do I, but I heard about it from my mom.)

My very first job, I founds out I was selected because I was the only applicant who wasn't married or planning a wedding. Even though everyone else probably had much more job experience, that didn't matter because they'd be devoting too much of their time to a wedding, then they'd probably have a kid and want maternity leave, etc.

I've never understood the whole equal pay issue, especially when men are given more money because "they have a family to support." If you've got the same education, same qualifications, and doing the same job, does it really matter? Should a single man with no kids get a paycut while a single mother gets a pay raise?

I know for a fact that sort of thing is still going on. I had three co-workers in the same department once: long-time married woman with kids, newly married woman with kids, newly married man with no kids, and single me. The guy made more money than the women. He was also the only one ever invited to the meetings which I had to transcribe minutes from someone's crappy notes. And our supervisor was a woman too. ::facepalm::

My brand of feminism is very similar to your. I often use a phrase a local DJ used ages ago when people brought up controversial topics, "Does it affect my paycheck or vacation time?" In other words, as long as it's consenting adults doing something that doesn't affect me, then why the hell should I care?

I read that tripe last week, and I think the subtitle of it should have been, "Penis is evil!"

Oh, every bit of it is still going on

[justalurkr.livejournal.com]

Of that, I have no doubt. It's just that the discriminating party has to go to a little more trouble to cover it up than back in the day. One hopes that it will soon be so much trouble to discriminate, no one will bother.